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Author: joemar4
Date: 09-26-03 09:19
I've been reading allot of posts here and I see "count calories" mentioned very often.
I know I've read and heard (quite a few times) that to count calories is not a good thing and one of the reasons most given for people giving up on their diets - "I hated having to count calories"
Now, I am no expert, not by far, so I'm asking.......has anyone else heard or read the same? Like I said, I've read that in magazines, heard in from so-called- experts on television, etc.
Now again, I'm not saying it's right or wrong. Whatever works for you, great, keep going. It's just that I took that advice and since June have lost 60lbs - not once counting a single calorie!!
I also just read in Mens Fitness that low calorie does not mean that it's a good thing. That you have to pay attention to the sugar content on the label. Again, I don't know if thats right or wrong. That's why I'm writing here.
I am following the Weight Watchers diet. I don't go to meeting's, I got a points book and a points calculator and after a while, you pretty much know what the point value for something is by just looking at the nutrition info on any product you buy.
For those who don't know how the diet works, heres a condensed version:
Depending on your weight, you are allowed a certain number of points for the day. If you stay whithin thoses points, you lose weight. If you exercise, depending on the exercise, you earn points back.
Points are figured out by a formula of calories, fat & dietary fiber. For food's that are not in the points book, you could use their calculator. Just insert the calories, fat and dietary fiber and hit enter, it tells you the point value.
Now, this might not be for everyone, you also might say, "Well, instead of calories, your counting points" Well, you would be right!! But I figured I would just throw it out here. It has been working for me. I have been losing the weight and never find myself hungry. Is that all because of the diet? Or is it in part because I finally was fed up with my weight and am determined to succeed? I thinks it's a combination of both.
But, back to my original reason for writing. I'd like to hear others and what their view are of counting calories. I always thought counting calories was the right thing to do, but after reading & seeing things to the contrary, I am wondering.
Thanks,
Joe
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Author: workin on it
Date: 09-26-03 09:34
Joe,
There are so many different opinions about weight loss out there that it is so confusing to many. My first experience with counting calories was when I got a personal trainer. She told me to keep a food diary for a week and then to add up my calories when the week was through. What a shock!!! No wonder I wasn't losing weight. I was eating way to many calories for my small frame and 5ft height. Then she put me on a 1200 calorie diet and exercise program. I counted calories for a few months and then you pretty much know how much you can eat. I don't count calories like I used to, but I do use the knowledge I gained from that experience to keep my portions in control. I know several people who have lost weight using weight watchers. Personally I doesn't interest me. I agree with you that people should do what works for them. I'm glad you found success. Keep up the hard work!
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Author: BFL Michelle
Date: 09-26-03 09:45
Counting points and counting cals in my mind is the same thing. I think it is important for someone that is just starting to lose weight to at least count their calories for a couple of weeks to get some beatings on how many calories they are ACTUALLY taking in versus what they think they are. Some people just don't realize. For me personally, when I stop logging things in, I use Firday now but before used a purse size calendar, I also stop losing weight. For those that really hate it, then they shouldn't do it. Not stop their weight loss journey becasue they think they HAVE to count. I think that is just an excuse. You can also watch portion sizes and types of food you eat. But the bottom line is weight loss is about cals in versus cals out and you don't know what you take in unless you count. So for some one that has just started, is at a plateau or think they should be losing and aren't, I think couting is critical.
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Author: Niki
Date: 09-26-03 09:52
Hi Joe,
Your progress has been fantastic! Great job and welcome to the forum
To answer your question, counting calories and the weight watchers point system are essentially similar. Both follow the same rules of "numbers in" being less than "numbers out". Although the Points system doesn't focus on what you are burning for your basal requirements, you can still use more points if you earn them by exercise, etc.
One big reason the points system seems to work better than the calorie thing is that it is designed, or rather disguised so you don't see a similarity to calorie counting. You can sneak something by as fewer points because of its low fat content and/or high fibre content. Like finding a great pair of pants on sale. A discount and we all love that.
I read that each WW point is roughly 50 calories (more or less depending on fat and fibre content). When I was in WW, I was eating somewhere around 30 pts/day. That's roughly 1500 calories. A low calorie intake intended to burn the excess fat stores. It just sounds a lot sexier to say 'points' :-)
Cheers,
Niki
*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-
The winner is the one who gets up every time she falls down
- K.Smith
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Author: Rhonda
Date: 09-26-03 10:22
I used to count calories, every single thing I ate. It was hard for me. I am very busy and don't like to take the time to figure out every calorie I have eaten. BUT, I did it for a while becuse I knew it was important to my weight loss.
Now, I pretty much know the calories of the regular things I eat and I don't count anymore. I do check out calories of new things I eat. I counted for a long enough time that I have a good idea of what I am eating throughout the day. It seems to be working for me, which is the whole idea - do what works for you!!
Rhonda 232/193/150
"Winners do what Losers won't"
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Author: Kleigh
Date: 09-26-03 10:50
Counting calories for me is very important for two reasons. When I first ended up at the Doctors for being faint and close to under weight she assigned me a nutritionist who then introduced me to the idea of logging everything. I was eating under 700 cals a day and exercising. When I stopped logging I slowly gained all the weight back plus some. Logging calories for me keeps me in check. (now I have the opposite problem, keeping calories from being too high and getting myself _to_ exercise.)
I have also found that it helps me to understand how to fuel my metabolism, something I never cared about before. Since I have been diagnosed with thyriod disease, it's a good side benefit to logging the calories. I think WW acts in the same way, I am just of the mideset if I have to count I might as well stick with what I know. I don't feel there is anything wrong with it as long as it's working. I hated counting calories at first. Now It's just something I know I need to do if I want to see any success. And it keeps me on track.
KLeigh
180/159/130 (FINALLY a pound gone!)
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Author: miranda
Date: 09-26-03 11:09
Weight loss is all about calories in vs. calories out, so whatever method you choose, it needs to incorporate calorie counting in some form, even if it's just a good feel for whether specific foods are high calorie or low calorie. I agree with BFL Michelle that it's important for most people to count calories meticulously for the first few weeks, because that's how long it takes for you to figure out your weak spots and get a feel for how many calories are in various kinds of food. Most people are really surprised at what they find out about their eating habits. After that, though, I think it's a matter of personal preference and ability. I, personally, need to count calories strictly to keep myself honest, and use Fitday.com religiously. I think most people really do need to write it down in some way, even just jotting down approximations, to ensure good results. There are so many posts from people who don't understand why they can't lose weight by "eating healthy" and doing a little exercise--calorie counting would explain that for them, as "healthy" does not necessarily mean "low calorie." Some people, though, seem to have a better "feel" for what they're eating, and can lose without strictly counting (wish I was one of them).
I don't plan to strictly count calories for the rest of my life, but I'm going to do at least until I've been at my goal weight for a while. I'm hoping that when I get to maintenance level, I'll eventually develop that "feel" for what I can eat without gaining weight, with help from my friend, the scale, who will relentlessly tell me when I've miscalculated. I think it's easier to maintain without calorie counting that it is to lose weight without calorie counting--hope so, anyway!
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miranda
230/169.5/145
"I don't need to compromise my principles, because they don't have the slightest bearing on what happens to me anyway."--Bill Watterson, "Calvin and Hobbes"
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Author: SassyGirl
Date: 09-26-03 11:15
The points system is pretty much the same as counting calories it is just that the work is done for you and you don't have to do the math if the food has already been broken down into points. I am doing WW also and it really is pretty much the same as counting calories so that is why it is working so well for you. It is a good diet but my body has just stopped losing fat so I am at a stand still, but I am not giving up and I like the diet too because I am eating things that I like. Good luck!
Smiles, Renee :)
"We either make ourselves miserable, or we make ourselves strong. The amount of work is the same."
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Author: BFL Michelle
Date: 09-26-03 11:23
Your right Miranda. I can easily maintain w/o counting but never lose. I too will stop counting when I get to my goal and have been there for awhile. But will always rely on the scale to make sure I'm not slipping back to my old ways.
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Author: Gary
Date: 09-26-03 11:30
....well, whether you "count" calories or not, a person still must eat less calories than their bodies need to maintain their current weight, in order to lose weight.
If a person is able to eat less calories than their body needs to maintain without keeping track of their calories, that is fine, but for many people that don't work because they might snack throughout the day and not realize when they are going over without keeping track.
One pound of weight = 3500 calories, so if your body needs "X" number of calories daily to maintain it's current weight, you still must eat less than "X" calories daily to lose weight, whether you keep track of it or not, right ? :-)
.....I am so happy with my success that it is no trouble to keep track of my daily calories, because that helps me to be sure that I am staying under my maintaince calories, and after losing about 85 lbs in the last 11 weeks I think I'll keep on counting calories :-)
For those who can keep their daily calories under the maintaince level without keeping track of them, that's great, but I need to know for sure :-)
Gary 360/175/175
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Author: Gary
Date: 09-26-03 11:37
....added note:
....I wrote my reply before I realized that they were saying count points instead, and that's fine if that is easier for you, to me it is still keeping track of calories in a round-about way, no offense, but I would prefer to stick with counting calories because calories-per-serving labels are put on most all foods, but points-per-serving are just put in weight-watcher's products in the grocery store, so when I go shopping I find it easier to go by calories because that is used with most all foods.
Gary 360/175/175
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Author: efs
Date: 09-26-03 11:44
When I first started this journey (Jan 2003) I made rules for myself to follow. For example #1-no eating after 7:30pm, etc, etc,... That type of thinking worked for about 3 months, but at that point I hit a plateau. The way I got out of it? I started counting my calories religiously.
I hope to reach the point someday where I just make consistent good choices, and am not always a slave to the journal, but to get to my goal I know I need to be completely honest with myself and counting calories is the best way I know to do that.
-Emily
efs 202/163/160
program start: Jan. 2003
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Author: joemar4
Date: 09-26-03 12:43
.....Yes, but if you have a Weight Watchers calculator (If your doing WW, you shouldn't be without one) you insert the calories per serving, as well as the fat per serving and the dietary fiber per serving. Hit one button and there it is - the point total.
So yes, counting calories or counting points, it's basically the same thing. It's just ones personal preferance as to which they rather do.
No matter which you do, as long as it works for you, keep at it. Thats the name of the game right?
Ok, I need to go eat something!! ;- )
Joe
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Author: Niki
Date: 09-26-03 13:41
Also, it's a lot easier to quickly add up your points for the day (e.g. total of 30) than having to add and carry all the numbers to add up calories.
4 + 3 +1 + 6 is a lot easier than 354 + 160 + 43 + 387
:-)
whatever works!
-Niki
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The winner is the one who gets up every time she falls down
- K.Smith
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Author: Gary
Date: 09-26-03 14:23
.....I agree, as long as it is working for you and you are getting enough nutritients to stay healthy, either way is fine.
Since I only buy low-fat and fat-free foods, just keeping track of the calories works for me.
....I just got done eating -
....I just had 2 delicious bologna and cheese sandwiches with the works
for only about 400 calories total !
Fat-free bologna - 20 calories a slice
Fat-free cheese - 25 calories a slice
Reduced calorie bread (toasted) - 40 calories a slice
Fat-free mayo - 10 calories a tbsp
lettuce, tomatoes, onions, pickles - (not many calories)
(the lettuce, tomatoes, onions and pickles really bulk up the sandwich
and make it very filling without adding that many more calories !)
Gary 360/175/175
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Author: Fabulous@50
Date: 09-26-03 15:32
I am not a "calorie counter" although I do think calorie (or points) counting is a valuable tool for many people trying to remove weight. It makes them very aware of what's good, what's not, and how much one has eaten.
Having said that, a fat person doesn't roam this earth for almost 5 decades (that's me) and not know what food is "good" and "not so good" when it comes to removing weight--unless they are trying to fool themselves. I've read more brochures, books, and pamphlets; and saw more movies, tv shows, and lectures about weight loss than most on this board. I personally don't feel the need at this time to maintain a log of calories (or points) for every molecule of food that passes my lips. (Although I would recommend it for lots of people.) So my approach is to eat proper portions of more of the "good" stuff and much, much less of the "not so good stuff" (supplemented by daily exercise, of course) and stick to my very realistic goal of removing only one pound a week (52 per year). So far it is working (knock on wood).
Like Rhoda, I pretty much know the value of calories and fat in most foods on the planet; those I don't, I just look at the label or look it up on the internet. But I'm not to the point of having to keep a running diary--I just make it a point to be more aware of my food intake, so I STOP before I eat ANYTHING and do a assessment: is the food the right thing in respect to my hunger, the time of day, and low calories and/or fat?--I also review in my mind how much I've eaten up to that point and how long to the next meal or snack. This exercise is part of my lifestyle change plans. I'm trying to make a lifestyle change from that of an out of control "fat lady" to that of a "fabulous, healthy diva." And when is the last time you saw a diva post the calorie count of her martini in a logbook?
Fabulous@50
225/156/150
Program Start: May 12, 2003
“Begin doing what you want to do now. We are not living in eternity. We have only this moment, sparkling like a star in our hand - and melting like a snowflake.”
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Author: Otta-no-better
Date: 09-26-03 16:09
I had snacks figured out that were about 100 cals and I'd have maybe 3 or 4 for supper and one for a break and so on. When I spoke with a friend about WW points, it sounded pretty familiar.
I'm sure it's probably about the same with the prepackaged food programmes.
My take was that I need to sink eye-ball deep in something. I was immersed in 'dieting' at first. Planning was all part of the exercise. Be single minded, live it, breath it .... and it'll happen.
I'm sure other folks can do this without becoming so obssessive.
Susan lost 40 lbs in 17 months
At goal, under 124 lbs since Sept. 10/04
Eat your protein, muscle is key
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Author: Doug
Date: 09-26-03 17:53
To lose weight you have to eat fewer calories. It doesn't really matter how you choose to do it.
When I first started losing wieght it was by concentrating on obvious things like reducing and eventually eliminating the second dinner I liked to call a "snack". I lost all but the last 20 or 30 pounds before I every counted a calorie. It was mostly pretty obvious where the problem was. But now I wish I had counted calories earlier, at least once. It turns out that there were more calories in things like fruit than I thought. I used to think that a couple of apples was both more filling and much less fattening than a candy bar. I was half right, the candy bar and apples have about the same amount of calories.
The WW system is simpler. But they try to motivate you to eat more of certain foods by lowering the points for foods like fruits and vegetables more than is justified by looking at the calories. I already eat a lot of these and would rather count the actual calories instead of letting someone else bias the numbers to fit what they believe is the best diet. Not that I disagree with WW, I eat a moderately low fat diet that is pretty close to what they suggest from what I have heard.
I agree with everyone else here in that as long as what you are doing works for you and you can stick with it for the rest of your life, you have found your personal solution.
Doug 272/164/170
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Author: Spud
Date: 09-28-03 11:41
Good points about WW's bias towards fruits and vegetables. My doctor even went as far as to say that "fruits and vegetables were free". Yeah, right. It doesn't matter if it's "healthy" food or not, a calorie is a calorie and they all count at the end of the day.
spud
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Author: Gary
Date: 09-28-03 15:56
I agree that as far as gaining or losing weight, a calorie is a calorie.
(of course it is preferrable that the calories we do eat are from healthy foods so as to get our minumum daily nutritients)
......but could you imagine if one of your doctor's other patients took his idea that "fruits and vegetables were free" to the extreme and ate about 5000 calories a day of fruit and vegetables and gained weight and went back and asked the doctor why they didn't lose weight :-)
Gary 360/175/175
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Author: joemar4
Date: 09-29-03 11:03
While fruits and vegetables are not "free", most are only 1 point in the Weight Watchers plan. Look at the calorie count of almost all vegetables and fruit. They are extremely low. And the fat? practically non-existint.
Heres a sample:
Carrot - 1 med = 35 calories
Celery - 4oz. = 9 calories
Cauliflower - 4oz. = 12 calories
Cucumbers - 1lrg = 39 calories
eggplant - 4oz. = 11 calories
Green Bean - 8oz. = 34 calories
Mushroom - 1 med = 5 calories
Green Onion - 4oz. = 13 calories
Bell Pepper - 1 med. = 18 calories
Tomatoes - 8oz. = 35 calories
Watermelon - 8oz = 51 calories
Apple - 8oz. = 65 calories
Grapes - 8oz. = 58 calories
Guava - 8oz. = 13 calories
Nectarine - 2 small/1 large = 67 calories
Orange - 1 med. = 62 calories
Peach - 2 med. = 94 calories
Pineapple - 8 oz = 76 calories
So, you see, you can eat alot of fruit and vegetables without worry. As far as someone taking the doctors advice and eating 5,000 calories of fruit and vegetables.......I'd like to see someone try to eat 5000 calories worth!!
I've been eating ALOT of fruit and vegetables and have lost over 60 lbs. since July!!
Joe
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Author: Gary
Date: 09-29-03 11:24
....I understand what your saying, and yes it would be a lot for someone to eat 5000 calories worth of fruit or veggies a day :-)
....my point is that they still have calories, they are not "free" as in 0 calories, so if someone ate enough fruit in addition to their regular diet then it could put them over their daily "maintaince" calories.
Gary 360/175/175
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Author: joemar4
Date: 09-29-03 15:57
Yes, I agree totally. Eating alot of fruit in addition to your regular meals will add up.
I just substitute fruit now for all the "bad" things I used to eat for dessert!!
Also, I use vegetables as a filler for my sandwichs. Instead of turkey, cheese - 4 slices each!! I now put 2 slices of turkey, no cheese and some bell pepper, onion, tomato, as a substitue. Still filling, less calories and fat!!
Hey, whatever works!! : - )
Joe
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Author: Gary
Date: 09-29-03 16:27
....I have an orange for breakfast in the morning, good vitiman C !
....Have you tried "Smart-Beat" cheese ?
....It is just 25 calories a slice and fat-free !
Gary 360/175/175
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Author: Doug
Date: 09-29-03 17:03
I also eat a LOT of fruit and vegetables. And they are a lot lower in calories than the alternatives. But they do add up.
One thing I still find curious is that WW seems to think fruit has fewer calories than other groups. For example every other calorie counter I have seen says a .5 pound apple is 125 Calories, WW rates it at 65. Fitday.com rates 8 ounces of seedless grapes at 154 Calories vs. the 53 WW lists.
I would expect some differences but that seems like a pretty big one.
Doug 272/164/170
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Author: joemar4
Date: 09-29-03 20:14
No, I haven't tried that cheese, but I will now! Is it available at most supermarkets?..................and thanks for letting me know about it!!
Joe
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Author: Gary
Date: 09-30-03 05:52
I usually do 90% of my shopping at "Super Fresh" and that is where I get it from, it is right in the same area with the regular sliced cheese.
If your store does not carry "Smart-Beat" Fat-Free cheese you can usually go to the service counter and put in a request that they carry it.
There are other brands that have fat-free cheese also but they might be higher in calories, I prefer Smart-Beat though because it is also cholesterol-free besides being the lowest in calories that I have seen.
(25 calories a slice)
Gary 360/175/175
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Author: joemar4
Date: 09-30-03 09:39
Hey Gary,
Thanks for the info! I appreciate it. I'm on my way out the door to go look for it now. I'll let you know if I'm successful finding it.
I am also going to see if I can find any other "helpful" foods. If I find anything new or exciting, I'll let everyone know.
Joe
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